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etee · Posted: Sun Oct 10, 2004 8:20 am Post subject: "Texas Justice"

Last week, a man who had spent 17 years on death row was released. Not because DNA proved he couldn't have done it, but because new tests showed that a crime was not committed! It seems he was convicted of arson, and since someone died in the fire it was also capital murder. Well, new tests revealed the fire likely was accidental.

Now, the question is whether or not the DA will certify his "actual innocence" so he can get paid for the 17 years he spent on death row. I for one am not holding my breath.

At the same time, we also had a man released who was sentenced to 60 years for rape, based on DNA evidence that said he didn't do it, and pointed to someone else as the rapist. The Harris Co. DA is still determined to retry him, as the victim says he did it. Similar to another rape case in Harris Co, where the victim still maintains she saw a specific person do it, even though DNA excluded him as well (and identified another person) Even though this man got a pardon, the DA still is convinced he did it, and won't sign a letter of "actual innocence." Both these DNA cases, by the way, were from our own HPD crime lab, where scientific facts were never allowed to get in the way of convicting the innocent.

Jeesh Rolling Eyes

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-etee
"Supreme Commander of the Buffalo Wing, Spicey Chicken Cartel"

BobCat · Posted: Sun Oct 10, 2004 9:16 am Post subject:

Heh. Proof that government agencies will not admit they made a mistake. It is not like the DA is going to get fired if they do. But avoiding taking responsibility for this, it is making them look bad.
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NealT · Posted: Sun Oct 10, 2004 8:49 pm Post subject:

IF (and I mean a BIG IF) those were the only two errors made in the system, then perhaps it would not be so bad. However, I would say they probably are not.

Having said that...I have to point out something though...Our system of justice, as flawed as it can be at times, is a whole lot better than other places I have lived or visisted...such as Korea, Turkey, France, Mexico, and a host of other places...For instance...

In Korea, a National Guardsman guarding a pipeline in deep southern Korea was allegedly found sleeping on the job...and summarily shot by his sergeant.

In Turkey, a test for DUI is that you blow in the face of a Turkish Judicial "Doctor". If he thinks you are drunk...you are guilty.

In France, you are guilty until proven innocent.

In Mexico, you are oftentimes it is said that money influences the guilty/not guilty verdict of the judge...
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BobCat · Posted: Sun Oct 10, 2004 9:51 pm Post subject:

Agreed, our system is better than others.

However, that doesn't mean our system doesn't have its flaws.

One thing our system has in common with the others' systems: employees of the government are not held responsible for mistakes.
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--BobCat
Spicey Chicken Cartel (tinSCC)#23, Lumber Cartel (tinLC)#1606
"Spam is used by lusers who don't want to do business with you ethically."

NealT · Posted: Mon Oct 11, 2004 7:59 am Post subject:

Oh I don't know about that...I had worked for the Gov't for over 30 years and as a Manager, I can tell you I have held a lot of people accountable for their errors...

I personally think it is just a lot more fun for people to poke at the Gov't because that way, they do not have to face up to the speficic individual...less stressful that way...

Then again, that is just MHO...
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BobCat · Posted: Mon Oct 11, 2004 8:10 am Post subject:

Well, maybe that's true in Texas (another reason I should move there) but in Illinois, we got more slime oozing out of our governments at all levels.
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--BobCat
Spicey Chicken Cartel (tinSCC)#23, Lumber Cartel (tinLC)#1606
"Spam is used by lusers who don't want to do business with you ethically."

NealT · Posted: Mon Oct 11, 2004 5:44 pm Post subject:

I don't live in TX any more...moved away several years ago because of the military...Personally, I think State Gov't is worse than federal.....
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BobCat · Posted: Tue Oct 12, 2004 6:56 am Post subject:

You were in the military?
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--BobCat
Spicey Chicken Cartel (tinSCC)#23, Lumber Cartel (tinLC)#1606
"Spam is used by lusers who don't want to do business with you ethically."

etee · Posted: Tue Oct 12, 2004 7:24 am Post subject:

Actually, he and I were stationed at the same AF base for a year or so. It made it real convenient when the family came to visit.
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Cheers,
-etee
"Supreme Commander of the Buffalo Wing, Spicey Chicken Cartel"

etee · Posted: Tue Oct 12, 2004 7:28 am Post subject:

BobCat · Posted: Tue Oct 12, 2004 9:23 am Post subject:

NealT · Posted: Tue Oct 12, 2004 4:25 pm Post subject:

Actually, there is only a limited 'no liability' for things...even those in the Fed and State can be sued for some actions...and be held personally accountable.

I think the answer lies in the willingness of the managers at the different levels to hold their own people accountable (both from a positive and a negative side) for their actions. If the upper level managers do that (practice not preach), then it will flow down to the level where it needs to go. The other part of that answer is that they must recruit and train good quality people...something a little hard to do with the wages that people actually make...
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MaryT · Mac user Joined: Nov 16, 2003 Posts: 80 Location: Amarillo

Ok, speaking as someone who, at least for now, works for state government - I know of a whole bunch of lawsuits against the State of Texas and its various agencies - most of which we tend to lose. Seems that really good lawyers don't want to work for state pay - imagine that!

And, while the highest of the mighty may not be held accountable, I can assure you that those of in the trenches are.